Ammar Habib Khan

Chief Risk Officer at Karandaaz

Compiled from 1 recorded interview. Every statement below is drawn from the passage cited beside it.

Ammar Habib Khan is the Chief Risk Officer at Karandaaz and has worked in risk management for about 12 years. He did a bachelor's degree in finance at IBA in Karachi and a master's in Barcelona. His career includes work at HSBC, where he was risk manager and economist for Pakistan.

Education

Khan did his high school in Karachi. He did a bachelor's degree in finance at IBA in Karachi. [1]

Khan chose a master's in economics. He did not want an MBA, because it would mean repeating the same kind of study. He has said that master's-level economics is purely mathematics. [1]

Khan did his master's in Barcelona, and he needed a study visa to go to Spain. He has said he did not want to go anywhere cold. [1]

HSBC

Khan worked at HSBC for some years. There he worked as risk manager and economist for Pakistan, and he also rated each country. He has said that HSBC stopped working in Pakistan because conditions in the country worsened around 2011 and 2012. [1]

Career

After returning, Khan did a little work with HBL. He started work on a Thar coal mine project, where he did financial modelling for the mine, working out coal output and sale price. He worked on the coal project for about three to four years and did some consulting on the side. [1]

Khan has worked in risk management for about 12 years. [1]

Karandaaz

Khan joined Karandaaz and has said he is still working there. He is the Chief Risk Officer. [1]

Khan has said that Karandaaz is funded by the UK's FCDO and the Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation, and that its funding is purely grants. He has said its ultimate aim is financial inclusion, which should reduce poverty. He has said SME lending is one of its critical mandates and that it runs a Women Venture Program for businesses run by women. [1]

Views

Khan has said that risk is part of everything and that his job is to decide how to manage, avoid or reduce it. He describes risk management as making sure a house has a good foundation and sound construction. He has said many people in Pakistan do not insure their cars, even after theft. He has also said that ideal risk management in Pakistan is basically Ayatul Kursi. [1]

Khan has said that after the financial crisis, international banks concluded they could not compete in these markets. He has said anti-money-laundering and terror financing rules raised costs for international banks. [1]

Khan has said the government is the biggest borrower in Pakistan. He has said banks regard lending to the government as risk-free. In his view, banks see no reason to do the hard work of SME lending while the government keeps borrowing. He has said the share of lending given to SMEs is one of the lowest in the world. [1]

Khan has said regulation in Pakistan is mostly anti-customer and anti-consumer. He has said regulators will not understand banking problems until they visit branches themselves. He has said it took him around 18 minutes to add a beneficiary before he could make a transfer. He has also said a bank's app is in fact its biggest branch. [1]

Khan has said cash is a drag on the economy. He has said Pakistan is one of the few countries that runs on cash, and that cash has zero cost for the consumer. [1]

Khan has said Pakistan discourages businesses from working formally rather than rewarding it. He has said Pakistan has zero digital adoption, and that financial inclusion will not happen until mindsets change. He has also said the problems change when one scales from 5,000 to 500,000 and then to 5 million. [1]

Khan describes Raast as a large pipe that carries only data. He has said data on Raast flows in two directions, unlike water in a pipe. He has said banks and fintechs could connect to the Raast data pipe, and that on Raast a person's phone number or identity card number would serve as their identity. [1]

Khan has said he once sent 100 rupees to someone using only an email address. He has said a cold drink can now be delivered to his home in 15 minutes through Foodpanda. He has said people in Beijing told him they only use AliPay, and that he uses JazzCash and EasyPaisa, and does so for charity. He has also said a regular salary account has a daily transfer limit of 20,000. [1]

Khan has said the worst case for Pakistan is that it keeps going the way it is. He has said Pakistan's population is growing at about 2% a year. He has said Pakistan and Vietnam had similar incomes until about 2004, and that Vietnam's income is now about four times Pakistan's. His best case is a per-capita income above $15,000 within 20 to 30 years. [1]

Khan has said about 60% of Pakistan's population is involved in agriculture. He has said that if water, basic schooling and health are covered, the economy will follow. He has said Pakistan has one of the worst yields per hectare in the world, and that the problem is not the land but that it has not been mechanised. [1]

Khan has said Thar coal is of very poor quality. He has said it is hard to transport because of its moisture. He has mentioned that a mine-mouth power plant is built alongside the mine. [1]

Khan has said new solar plants cost about 6 to 7 rupees per unit, and that this figure includes building, operating and a return for investors. He has said that of 25 rupees, about 10 rupees is taxes. He has said the weighted average fuel cost is never above 7 to 7.5 rupees. He has also said only 80 units reach the home. [1]

Khan has said taxes on everyday goods are regressive, so the poorest pay the most as a share of income. He has said a tax number should be enough, and that a taxpayer passport is not needed. [1]

Khan has said people disappearing after entering on visas is a genuine issue. He has said a Pakistani passport rarely gets a visa easily. [1]

Personal life

Khan has said his wife runs an e-commerce business. He has said he has used credit cards for about 12 years, and that across about 100 to 150 of his orders, none has had a problem. He has said he will stay in Pakistan after retirement. He has also said he never felt that anyone treated him in a racist way. [1]

Timeline

2011
According to Khan, conditions in Pakistan worsened around 2011 and 2012, and HSBC stopped working in the country.[1]

Appearances

DateTitleWhere
2021-09-10 Pakistan's regulations are built to punish, not to enable Thought Behind Things

Frequently asked questions

Who is Ammar Habib Khan?

Ammar Habib Khan is the Chief Risk Officer at Karandaaz. He has worked in risk management for about 12 years. His career includes work at HSBC and HBL.[1]

What does Ammar Habib Khan do?

Ammar Habib Khan is the Chief Risk Officer at Karandaaz. He has said that risk is part of everything and that his job is to decide how to manage, avoid or reduce it.[1]

Where did Ammar Habib Khan study?

Ammar Habib Khan did his high school in Karachi. He did a bachelor's degree in finance at IBA in Karachi. He then did a master's in Barcelona, having chosen economics for it.[1]

What is Ammar Habib Khan's work history?

Ammar Habib Khan worked at HSBC as risk manager and economist for Pakistan, and did a little work with HBL. He also worked on a Thar coal mine project. He has since joined Karandaaz, where he has said he is still working.[1]

What did Ammar Habib Khan do on the Thar coal project?

Ammar Habib Khan started work on a Thar coal mine project. He did financial modelling for the mine, working out coal output and sale price. He worked on the project for about three to four years and did some consulting on the side.[1]

What has Ammar Habib Khan said about Karandaaz?

Ammar Habib Khan has said that Karandaaz is funded by the UK's FCDO and the Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation, and that its funding is purely grants. He has said its ultimate aim is financial inclusion, which should reduce poverty. He has also said SME lending is one of its critical mandates.[1]

What does Ammar Habib Khan think of regulation in Pakistan?

Ammar Habib Khan has said regulation in Pakistan is mostly anti-customer and anti-consumer. He has also said regulators will not understand banking problems until they visit branches themselves.[1]

References

  1. Pakistan's regulations are built to punish, not to enable . Thought Behind Things , 2021-09-10.
Show the source passages (80 statements)
  1. He did his high school in Karachi. High school maine Karachi se kiya tha. Karachi mein ek school hai BVS Parsi High School.
  2. He did a bachelor's degree in finance at IBA in Karachi. Karachi mein IBA. IBA se bachelors kara wahan pe koi samjhen koi char saal ka bachelors kara finance mein.
  3. He worked at HSBC for some years. HSBC mein tha main kuch arse ke liye.
  4. At HSBC he worked as risk manager and economist for Pakistan. I was risk manager as well as the economist for Pakistan there.
  5. At HSBC he also rated each country. HSBC jo hai ek rating karta hai har mulk ki toh main uski bhi rating karta tha.
  6. He says HSBC stopped working in Pakistan because conditions in the country worsened around 2011 and 2012. Woh kyun nahi kaam karna kyunki aapko pata hoga 2011, 2012 mein kuch halaat aise ho gaye the mulk ke, duniya ke toh hue hi the, mulk ke bhi aise ho gaye the unhone bola ke nahi ji hum Pakistan mein ab kaam nahi kar sakte.
  7. He says that after the financial crisis, international banks concluded they could not compete in these markets. Post financial crisis jo hai woh unka ek theory unki yeh aayi ke ji hum in markets mein compete nahi kar sakte.
  8. He says anti-money-laundering and terror financing rules raised costs for international banks. Money laundering ka, anti-terror financing ki woh regulations bahut zyada badh gayin. Toh jitne bhi yeh bade bank the, international bank the, unki yeh cost badh gayi.
  9. He chose a master's in economics. Maine socha ke ji ek hum karte hain economics mein masters.
  10. He did not want an MBA, because it would mean repeating the same kind of study. Maine kaha yaar MBA nahi karna wohi cheez phir se padh ke kya karna?
  11. He says master's-level economics is purely mathematics. Graduate school pe masters level pe jo economics hai woh sirf aur sirf math hai aur kuch bhi nahi hai.
  12. He did his master's in Barcelona. Masters ke liye phir main chala gaya Barcelona.
  13. He says he did not want to go anywhere cold. Maine bola yaar mujhe kisi aisi jagah nahi jana tha jahan pe sardi hoti ho.
  14. He needed a study visa to go to Spain. Jab main ja raha tha Spain toh mujhe study visa chahiye tha.
  15. He says he never felt that anyone treated him in a racist way. Mujhe kabhi feel nahi hua ke ji kisi ne mujhe as a jise kehte hain woh racist koi baat kari ya kuch kari, never.
  16. After returning, he did a little work with HBL. Wapas aa gaye, phir yahan pe ek idara hota hai, HBL abhi bank ke saath thoda sa kaam kara.
  17. He started work on a Thar coal mine project. Thar coal ki ek mine pe maine kaam shuru kara.
  18. He did financial modelling for the mine, working out coal output and sale price. Basically jo bhi koyla kitne ka niklega zameen se, Right. aur woh kitne ka bikega. Theek hai. Woh main determine karta tha.
  19. He worked on the coal project for about three to four years and did some consulting on the side. Woh coal wale pe main khayal hai teen char saal kaam kiya, thoda side mein consulting karta raha.
  20. He joined Karandaaz and says he is still working there. Phir uske baad finally main Karandaaz mein aaya jo ke abhi tak main kaam chal raha hai.
  21. He says Karandaaz is funded by the UK's FCDO and the Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation. funded by FCDO, which is Foreign Commonwealth and Development Office of United Kingdom. Right. And the Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation.
  22. He says Karandaaz's funding is purely grants. These are purely grants, jinka maqsad jo hai, ultimate objective yeh hai ke financial inclusion ho is mulk mein.
  23. He says Karandaaz's ultimate aim is financial inclusion, which should reduce poverty. ultimate objective yeh hai ke financial inclusion ho is mulk mein. Aur financial inclusion ke through ghurbat kam ho.
  24. He says cash is a drag on the economy. Toh is tarah yeh hota hai cash is a drag on economy.
  25. He says SME lending is one of Karandaaz's critical mandates. Doosra jo ek mandate hai bahut critical woh hai SMEs jo hain, jo chhote idare hote hain ek economy mein, Small and Medium Enterprises.
  26. He says the government is the biggest borrower in Pakistan. Hukumat jo hai it is the biggest borrower. Sabse bada jo borrower hai is mulk mein woh hukumat hai.
  27. He says banks regard lending to the government as risk-free. Bank yeh kehta hai ke yaar jab hukumat mujhse paise leke 8% pe de rahi hai aur hukumat ka paisa risk free hai.
  28. He says banks see no reason to do the hard work of SME lending while the government keeps borrowing. Bank kehta hai yaar itni mehnat kyun karein hum? Hukumat le rahi hai toh dete raho paise jab tak le rahi hai, le rahi hai.
  29. He says the share of lending given to SMEs is one of the lowest in the world. SMEs ko jo jitna diya hua hai that's one of the lowest duniya ke sabse kam sharaon mein se ek hai.
  30. He says Karandaaz runs a Women Venture Program for businesses run by women. Ek aur hamara jo program hai woh hai khawateen ke jo businesses hain unko support karna, Women Venture Program usko hum kehte hain.
  31. He says his wife runs an e-commerce business. Like so my wife has an e-commerce business and we went through this entire process of, you know, getting the vendors and what not.
  32. He says he has used credit cards for about 12 years. pichle koi 12 saal se main credit card istemal kar raha hoon
  33. He says financial inclusion will not happen until mindsets change. Matlab is tarah financial inclusion nahi ho sakti jab tak ke mindset change na ho.
  34. He says regulation in Pakistan is mostly anti-customer and anti-consumer. hamare yahan jo regulation banti hai that is mostly anti-customer and anti-consumer.
  35. He says regulators will not understand banking problems until they visit branches themselves. jab tak regulator khud branch mein jaake khada nahi hoga, theek hai, aur kaam nahi karega, usko andaaza nahi hoga problem kya hai.
  36. He says it took him around 18 minutes to add a beneficiary before he could make a transfer. it took me around 18 minutes to add them as a beneficiary before I can make the transfer.
  37. He says a bank's app is in fact its biggest branch. Your app is also your branch, and in fact your app is the biggest branch.
  38. He describes Raast as a large pipe that carries only data. Ek bada pipe hai jismein sirf data hai.
  39. He says data on Raast flows in two directions, unlike water in a pipe. Raast mein jo data ka flow hai, that will be in two directions.
  40. He says banks and fintechs could connect to the Raast data pipe. Is pipe mein ek bank ne connect kara, phir dusre bank ne bhi connect kara, kisi fintech ne connect kara
  41. He says that on Raast a person's phone number or identity card number would serve as their identity. jo aapka phone number hai na, essentially woh aapki identity ban jayega, ya aapka identity card number jo hai, woh aapki identity hoga.
  42. He says he once sent 100 rupees to someone using only an email address. Maine sirf uska email address dala, maine usmein paise dale ke yaar mujhe itne fala fala 100 rupaye transfer karne hain.
  43. He says a cold drink can now be delivered to his home in 15 minutes through Foodpanda. ab mere ghar pe thandi Coke sirf 15 minute mein deliver ho sakti hai. Right. Theek hai. Theek hai, Foodpanda ke through.
  44. He says Pakistan is one of the few countries that runs on cash. Pakistan ek chand un mulkon mein se hai jo cash pe kaam karte hain.
  45. He says across about 100 to 150 of his orders, none has had a problem. Aaj tak aisa nahi hua, aaj tak. Theek hai, matlab mera khayal hai jo koi 100-150 order mere cumulative honge usmein, ke kabhi kisi order mein koi masla ho. Theek hai, nahi hota.
  46. He says Pakistan discourages businesses from working formally rather than rewarding it. Hum incentivise nahi karte hain businesses ko formally kaam karne mein, hum discourage karte hain.
  47. He says Pakistan has zero digital adoption. Yahan pe aap dekh lein, there is zero digital adoption.
  48. He says people in Beijing told him they only use AliPay. Within one year, This is like one of the biggest cities in the world. Sunen, sunen aap. Beijing ki baat kar raha hun. 17 mein use kar diya, woh kehte hain yaar hum sirf AliPay use karte hain.
  49. He says he uses JazzCash and EasyPaisa, and does so for charity. main sirf aur sirf JazzCash aur EasyPaisa yeh kaam ke liye istemal karta hoon. Woh karta hoon main charity ke liye.
  50. He says a regular salary account has a daily transfer limit of 20,000. normal apni salary account se usmein paise transfer karunga, uski bhi ek daily limit hai ki 20,000 se zyada transfer nahi kar sakte aap.
  51. He says cash has zero cost for the consumer. magar cash has zero cost for the consumer.
  52. He says the problems change when one scales from 5,000 to 500,000 and then to 5 million. Jab suddenly aap 5,000 se 5 lakh aur 5 million pe scale karte ho na, toh aapke masail different hote hain.
  53. He says the worst case for Pakistan is that it keeps going the way it is. Worst case scenario yeh hai, we continue the way we are going right now.
  54. He says Pakistan's population is growing at about 2% a year. hamari jo abadi ki growth hai, woh taqreeban 2 fisad hai.
  55. He says Pakistan and Vietnam had similar incomes until about 2004. in fact 2004 tak Pakistan aur Vietnam ki income barabar thi.
  56. He says Vietnam's income is now about four times Pakistan's. Now Vietnam ki jo income hai, that is 4 times of Pakistan.
  57. He says his best case is a per-capita income above $15,000 within 20 to 30 years. Best case scenario would be our income level should be $15,000 plus per capita, 30 years mein, 20 years mein.
  58. He says about 60% of Pakistan's population is involved in agriculture. ki 60 fisad jo hai hamari abadi woh agri mein involved hai.
  59. He says if water, basic schooling and health are covered, the economy will follow. agar pani, basic school, health, theek hai, yeh teen-char cheezein cover ho jaati hain, toh baaki phir economy apne aap chal jayegi.
  60. He says Pakistan has one of the worst yields per hectare in the world. I mean, we have the one of the worst yields per per hectare. One of the worst yields in the world.
  61. He says the problem is not the land but that it has not been mechanised. Aur yeh problem zameen ka nahi hai, yeh problem aapka hai, aapne mechanized nahi kiya hua usko.
  62. He says he will stay in Pakistan after retirement. retirement ke baad main Pakistan mein hi rahoonga, bahar jaake kya karunga main?
  63. He says Thar coal is of very poor quality. Yeh achcha Thar ka jo koyla hai uski quality jo hai na woh bahut kharab hai.
  64. He says Thar coal is hard to transport because of its moisture. jab moisture hota hai aur oxygen se react hota hai toh usme lag jaati hai aag. Theek hai. Toh woh easily transportable nahi hai woh koyla.
  65. He mentions that a mine-mouth power plant is built alongside the mine. mine ke saath hi ek cheez hoti hai mine mouth power plant.
  66. He says new solar plants cost about 6 to 7 rupees per unit. Solar abhi jo naye plant lag rahe hain 6 rupay 7 rupay unit ke lagte hain woh.
  67. He says the 6 rupee solar figure includes building, operating and a return for investors. Yeh jo 6 rupay unit ki baat kar raha hoon main aapse, yeh sab kuch included hai isme. Theek hai. Usko lagana, usko operate karna, let's say koi 20 saal ki basis pe 6 rupay unit lagega toh jitne logon ne paisa lagaya unko thoda faida bhi ho jayega.
  68. He says that of 25 rupees, about 10 rupees is taxes. 25 rupay mein se sir 35%. 35% kitna ho gaya 25 rupay ka? Taqreeban 8 se 9 rupay ho gaya. 10 rupay ho gaya in fact. Right. Theek hai. 10 rupay sirf taxes hain.
  69. He says the weighted average fuel cost is never above 7 to 7.5 rupees. weighted average kabhi 7, 7.5 rupay se zyada ki aapki fuel cost nahi hai.
  70. He says only 80 units reach the home. Aapke ghar tak pahunchte pahunchte sirf 80 unit bachte hain.
  71. He says taxes on everyday goods are regressive, so the poorest pay the most as a share of income. Har cheez pe agar aap uski income theek hai percentage of his income agar aamdani se aap link karoge toh sabse zyada tax sabse ghareeb aadmi deta hai. This is regressive taxation.
  72. He says people disappearing after entering on visas is a genuine issue. So yeh jo hai na yeh ek bada critical issue hai ke log ja ke bahut zyada log ghayab bhi ho jate hain, bahut zyada log slip ho jate hain. Yeh yeh ek genuine issue hai.
  73. He says a Pakistani passport rarely gets a visa easily. Pakistani passport aapko pata hai visa waise hi nahi milta, badi mushkil se milta hai.
  74. He says a tax number should be enough, and a taxpayer passport is not needed. You don't need a tax payer passport. Theek hai? Aapko jo tax number hai that should be enough.
  75. He says he has worked in risk management for about 12 years. taqreeban koi 12 saal se main risk management mein hi hoon mukhtalif cheezon ki.
  76. He says risk is part of everything, and his job is to decide how to manage, avoid or reduce it. Us cheez ko kis tarah manage karna hai, kis tarah aapne risk ko avoid karna hai, kis tarah us cheez ko kam karna hai, woh main karta hoon.
  77. He describes risk management as making sure a house has a good foundation and sound construction. Magar aap ensure karenge ke is ghar ki foundation achi hai, is ghar ki construction sahi hui hui hai.
  78. He says many people in Pakistan do not insure their cars, even after theft. Log insurance nahi karate gadiyon ki. Apni toh chhoden, log gadiyon ki insurance nahi karate, gadiyan chori ho jati hain.
  79. He says ideal risk management in Pakistan is basically Ayatul Kursi. Ideal risk management in Pakistan is basically Ayatul Kursi.
  80. He is the Chief Risk Officer. As Chief Risk Officer, What does he do?