Shahveer Jafry on why you should never have a plan B

चलो मैं ख़वादिना आज रात welcome back to another episode of Thought BAND Things आज हमारे साथ मौजूद आई बहुत ही ख़ास मेहमान जो कि हर episode से पहले मैं यह फिर containers आ गए but this time he made sure that we leave इस्लामाबाद. But the guest we have today with us is a very very special guest because he is going to drive a ton of views. I am very happy. There is gonna be a lot of dollars coming my way. It's one of the biggest creators in Pakistan, Shahveer Jaffrey.

I'm Akhiladelphia. Shahveer भाई, how are you? Very good, मज़हबल भाई. Thank you so much and very pleased to be on here. I've been looking forward to speaking to you for a very very long time. Even the first time when you invited me I got very happy but containers. Containers ने पहुंचे ना. अभी भी वही situation है हम वहीं खड़े में है. कुछ move नहीं हो रहा.

But इस बार at least आपका शहर ख़साफ है. हमें डेचना के स्नाव होता है पता नहीं क्या scene let's hope कि हम वापस पहुंच जाए but I heard you just got back from Singapore. Yes. Was that or did?

Morning. So basically YouTube's creator summit, YouTube's official creator summit They recognize Pakistan for the first time and I along with my cousin Sundus who is my podcast host and Ducky. Us three were representing Pakistan in Singapore Mhmm. Which obviously came as a surprise to me that I was selected in the first place but they said hey come over and it was amazing man it was it was really really nice. होता क्या है creator summit में? Basically creator summit में मैं यह होता है YouTube अपने जितने भी regional creators है ना for example Pakistan से, India से, Singapore, Korea, China इन सब को बुलाता है और कहता है कि यार आप लोग हमारे लिए इतना काम करते हैं आप लोग इतनी अच्छी अच्छी videos बनाते हैं तो this is our way of showing you love and giving back to you and also this is one way of you meeting one another Collaborative cross and उस तरह से है. Exactly and also this is we're gonna share a ton of information with you what is new up and about coming on to YouTube very very soon. So there's a lot of things that I that I have and I could share with you based on if you wanna hear them in privacy or on camera. वह आपके ऊपर depend करता है. I would love to hear them on on camera. Sure. Because you know I'd like to have everyone absolutely get a get an insight. I was I was I was gonna do my own podcast on this, here we go. Here we go. Hey, Here we go. No problem. No problem. But

and important, are these changes coming also to Pakistan as well because more often than not we hear things and then it's just it's just like कि हम तो side पर हैं और actually तो वह बड़ी markets पिचा रहे हैं. Yes YouTube has started taking Pakistan a little more seriously lately

and this shouldn't come as a surprise क्योंकि Pakistan एक बहुत बड़ी market है although the economy couldn't be the perfect economy और aspiring economy नहीं है जहां हम होना चाह रहे थे वहां हम नहीं है अभी but regardless there's a lot of people a young population और market इन सारी चीज़ों को देखती है और YouTube specially इन सारी चीज़ों को देखता और कहता है कि hey potential what can we do here that we haven't done before? Let's open up Pakistan, let's open up conversation with Pakistan and let's, try to see कि what Pakistan can bring and that being said the one thing that I took out from the entire event is the fact that YouTube shorts is going to be far more

serious than हां anybody मैं रवेर सवाल ही आने वाला था कि do you do you think a large part of this sudden interest could be कि पहले वह auto पर बस ठीक है Pakistan market go कर रही थी but suddenly with TikTok really giving them a run for their money. You think that's a there's a that level of insecurity where they're like ok listen guys like थोड़ा सा इनका ख्याल करते हैं. Absolutely.

I think यार TikTok is such a huge platform now and the views it drives the the algorithm in general everybody wanted to copy that everybody wanted to see कि यार हम इस तरह का क्या कर सकते हैं कि हम TikTok को compete कर सकें and I guess everybody just came up with came over different things for example Instagram came out with reels, YouTube came out with shorts. Yeah. Snapchat has its own spotlight feature now. So it's like endless scrolling is basically what each company wants to achieve and they want to see कि उनके creators क्या content बना सकते हैं जो कि viewers को on par रखे on on the apricot side of the apricot and keep us So obviously YouTube had to come out with YouTube shorts and they are investing heavy into it and not only that जो लोग भी YouTube shorts बना रहे हैं उन लोगों के लिए revenue sharing भी open होने लगी अब. ठीक है. Starting in Feb. नहीं so question

and again you are not the right person to ask this question probably the YouTube representative but as a as consumer when I look at YouTube shorts मुझे बड़ा भी confusing सी अभी इस वक्त space लगती है because YouTube generally is a very well managed, very well structured space in a way कि it might have all of the trash that it generally any platform has but वहां पर आपको नज़र आ रहा आपको नज़र आ रहा है creator YouTube नज़र आ रहा है, आपको आपको publisher YouTube नज़र आ रहा है, आपको political YouTube नज़र आ रहा है. Shorts is this really random you know you are scrolling and it's a lot of copy paste content here and there. Do you think the user experience जितना for example as a creator मेरे लिए बड़े अजीब से user experience है अगर the shorts start appearing on my main role, right? Like I am just I don't want to dirty it up. I have so many podcasts आप जाते खूबसूरत सा scroll आता है. Yeah. Off episodes and then suddenly अगर मैं shorts डालना शुरू कर दूं अपने main channel के ऊपर तो which makes a lot of sense कि मैं shorts डालूं a lot more people are gonna be interested but it ruins the user experience and I feel like shorts YouTube की तरफ से seems a lot like a like an emergency reactive चलो जी जी से product introduce करा दो not a very well thought out design feature.

Yeah I am sure that's like a freaking trillion dollar company if anything I mean I mean I am sure they have thought a lot about this but I feel like what it really comes down to is what जितने भी products होते हैं ना they're user driven basically. तो they they basically see कि यार लोग किधर जा रहे हैं लोग क्या करना चाह रहे हैं लोगों की अगर attention span कम रहा है उसके पीछे क्या stats हैं? अगर आप भी देखो हम लोग डेढ़ डेढ़ घंटे की मैं भी क्योंकि podcast करता हूं अगर मैं डेढ़ दो घंटे की podcast लगाता भी हूं उसके ऊपर retention कितनी होती है? ज़्यादा से ज़्यादा भी अगर बहुत अच्छी retention हो तो वह बीस minute. Skip through the parts that they don't wanna watch. So at the end of the day there's a very limited amount of people who podcast really captures. It's a niche. Yeah, absolutely. Right? It's a niche. Majority of the people are the scroll freaks. Yeah. Including myself. Like, I find myself in that position a lot of times. Like, my parents, I've seen them do this. I've seen my wife do this that, you know, when we're on the phone, we just keep scrolling, scrolling, scrolling, scrolling. We go like, this is endless scrolling. It never ends and you never wanna end. And that is why what that is what YouTube wants to achieve in my personal opinion. And I think they're gonna do it with with shorts. But they they seem like the मतलब the push is very real from there. Push is very real and by the way you know they're integrating into your account in a way where you're not even gonna you don't need a second account to upload shorts.

You can upload shorts within your account and it's only going to feature in the shorts tab of your account. अच्छा अच्छा वो वाला जो मैंने problem बताया वो वैसे sort हो जाएगा. कई short वाले site पर हो जाएंगे and then you can utilize that as a great way to feed the audience and then convert some of that to your more Exactly.

Long format. There are creators from Pakistan that I forgot the name of but they showed me some creators from Pakistan. Actually the most subscribed creator in Pakistan who's a creator not a TV or Jio TV. He's 10,000,000 subscribers strong. Pakistan? Exactly my point nobody knows about that. Did you know about that? I didn't. I didn't know about that either they showed me this guy I think हुसैन और हसन or something and he's a shorts creator because shorts drive the amount of subscription shorts drive it's insane. Is he doing like a VO based clips

put together? Is he doing like legit face first? He's doing

I saw a little bit of his content it's basically like comedy. सुनीती दे देर आनी तो चाहिए. There there I think he does these comedy sketches on his YouTube shorts and I I really don't remember his name but you know I'm gonna message my YouTube manager I'm gonna to ask him one second. Hey buddy what's up? Can you please send me that that guy's link from YouTube who does YouTube shorts who has 10,000,000 subscribers?

So the the the growth is very real there and that's the next frontier for a lot of creators.

I mean if you if you if you just dissect the entire social media evolution you'll see que it started with what vine? Seven second videos, six second videos then it just went into Instagram then it went to long form content like YouTube videos, vlogs. वह सारा culture एक शुरू हुआ. उसके बाद I feel like we're going back to the the vine era. Right. Where people don't have a lot of attention span and companies have realized कि यार अगर हम if we can quickly provide a lot of dopamine and each swipe to a certain user that is more profitable for us. Yeah. And that makes us more money. And the February monetizing situation is also going to be live for Pakistan? Yeah, that's the best part. That's the best part. I wish I could say कि I drove that decision but I think I have nothing to do with it. I try to take. मैं बड़ी कोशिश की मैंने कहा मेरी वजह वजह से हो गई. मैंने कहा ok. मैं सबको बताऊंगा मेरी वजह से हुआ.

But yeah they're bringing it to Parkinson. I'm very happy for that. Very cool, very cool. चलिए, I'm gonna switch to our regular programming the way we normally do. I wanna have an understanding of really where where you were born and and and where you grew up, and a little bit about your early life. Sure, man.

So my name is Shahbir. I was born in Karachi, raised in Lahore. I spent two years in Houston, Texas. I spent more than fifteen years in Canada, Toronto.

That's a that's a slightly odd transition. I know. Did you guys go for immigration into The US? Did you go for a job and then went to Canada? What happened there? So basically my dad had a business opportunity in The United States

लेकिन वह उस तरह mature नहीं हो सकी जिस तरह हम सोच रहे थे उसी time पर हमने Canadian visa भी apply किया हुआ था sorry Canadian residency हमें वह मिल गई. Right. And so you went to Canada? What part of Canada? Toronto. I mean आप कहते हैं उसको Toronto ही है लेकिन वह. छोटी city side पर जो होगी वह suburb type की जो होगी. Suburb जो है हमारा वह पड़ता था Brampton at the time. अच्छा. We moved there and then now we have been living in Milton for the past

eight eight ish years. Milton is also a suburb or is it a Yeah. It's like Gulberg DHA. I see. That's the distance between the two. How was how would you compare if you have any memories? How would you compare US with Canada? Living wise I am sure you have been to The US multiple times ever since but living living एक फ़र्क होता ना culture का फ़र्क होता है. यार Houston was obviously like

season wise these places are like far apart. एक में दबा के गर्मी पड़ती और एक में दबा के सर्दी पड़ती है. लेकिन I think for what I remember US के अंदर जो पाकिस्तानी community थी ना वह बहुत ज़्यादा strong थी Houston के अंदर specially और वहां पर मुझे अभी तक याद है कि हमारी जो जो पाकिस्तानी community जिनके साथ हम घुल मिल गए थे और जिन ये लोग Fridays को dinners किया करते थे, बाहर जाया करते थे लोग बड़ा मज़ा आता था. In Canada we I actually did not feel the same way like maybe it's just हां small closed

I would say so. Do you think that's also because of एक ही भी फ़र्क होता ना कि big city versus small. So Houston do you think it would have been the same if you were in New York? Because वो होता ना कि बड़े शहर में अपने शहर मुल्का भी बंदा हो ये just too happening.

I I can't pinpoint what exactly it is लेकिन US में मुझे मज़ा बहुत आता था और जब हम लोग नए नए Canada move हुए थे और हमारे दो साल Canada में भी उतना ही time हो गया था जितना हम लोगों ने US move जा रहा तो हमने सब ने कहा था कि यार US was way better than Canada but obviously now we have in terms of my personality. We are talking about you are talking

about weather. Since you mentioned you are still entering the year.

Sorry, यह आता रहेगा थोड़ी थोड़ी देर में like mind ना गिरना. यार I would go with extremely cold. उसकी वजह मैं बता देता हूं. उसकी वजह यह cold you can actually block off. With with like jackets. Jackets. Yeah. And heaters. Yeah. यार hot बहुत बहुत चिपचिपाहट पसीना तीन second गर्मी में आप रहो आपको आपकी body react कर लेते हैं. Cold में अगर कोई center heating होती है आप पंद्रह बीस minute आराम से बर्दाश्त कर लेते हैं मार के. यार Canada के अंदर you don't even realize it's negative 50 outside. Canadian society have my dad actually my dad is a funny guy so वो कहते कि यार मुझे समझ नहीं आती कि कौन को किस किसके दिमाग ने इजाज़त दी जब यह early settlements हो रही थी यहां पर? कौन आया यहां क्या? Toronto क्यों? Negative 50 क्यों? क्या ज़रूरत थी यहां रहने की? क्या काम था इन लोगों को? Railways बिछा दी यह कर दिया, वह कर दिया. Is there any better temperature within the whole of I mean I know Vancouver

वह तो काफी दरमियान का अच्छा Very tropical Vancouver. उसकी belt के ऊपर और areas नहीं है जहां पर मतलब it doesn't make sense you are right के जो सबसे बड़ी settlement है वह Toronto which is so far up. हां.

Like why did civilization decide that? Like why did people decide कि यार हां चलो negative 50 good यार वहां चलकर रहते हैं. कपड़े कपड़े बना लेंगे, igloos में रहेंगे. क्यों? तो I don't know but to answer your question I don't I don't know if there more places like Vancouver I think वह एक certain belt होगी the thing about Canada is Canada की जो geography है ना पूरा Canada US के border पर रहता है. पूरा का पूरा Canada. ठीक है. जितना आप north जाते रहेंगे उतनी ज़्यादा आपको population कम कम होती रहेगी और Canada is I think one of the largest country, second largest या third largest country in the world है

लेकिन population wise it's it's pretty small क्योंकि वह slim line पर पूरा Canada रह रहा है. अबाद है. जो border US के साथ आपका match हो रहा Do you think यह global warming हो गया and all of us will be basically all of these lands will be unlivable. They will go live in Russia and Canada.

I I I really hope everybody comes to Canada. I need more friends there, man. Absolutely. I think that too. And Canada has, I love Canada because, yeah, Canada is one of the safest countries. And when you factor in all of what is happening with the present day earth and humans and we're on the brink of World War three as a lot of people say, you just feel extremely safe and secure in a country like Canada and I feel like सब दुनिया के मस्त है अपनी तरफ और वह site वगैरह. हां, उनके पास पानी भी अपना है दुनिया का सबसे बड़ा fresh water reservoir they have it and they're just genius or blessed whichever one it is I don't know Basics में वह survive कर लेंगे. They're not necessary. I think Canada is gonna be the last country to disappear. I think everybody's gonna come to Canada.

About this incident? Zealand I also feel like is a very, सुकून से side पर बैठे हुए हैं, कोई tension नहीं है. दुनिया में I haven't been, I don't care. I can't all the way.

सही है मतलब आपने अपने passport को hold पर रखा है दिया है कि भाई मैं agents रखता हूँ लेता हूँ तो मैं रखता हूँ agents.

देखो मुझे पता नहीं ना कौन सा Canadian देख रहा है By the way this is something that I have noticed and I have my own siblings who are Canadians. Canadians नहीं छोड़ते. वो मेरे American siblings हैं. उनसे मैं कहूंगा आपका America कितना बुरा हो गया, अजीब सा हो गया है, वैसा polarized हो गया हो गया हो हो कहेंगे हां पागल है America. Canadian sibling से आप जब बात करोगे ना कि यार Canada बड़ा अजीब है. क्यों अजीब है भाई? किसने

बोला तू यह था? There

is there is something there that really makes the Canadian वह बेशक job के लिए अच्छे पैसों के लिए छोड़ के नक्ता पर अमिकार चला जाएगा लेकिन उसके अंदर दिल में Canada हमेशा रहता है for some reason. यार पता है क्या है actually

again my parents have spoken so much about this to all the kids कि वह कहते हैं कि यार the the country has provided so much for us. The government of that country has provided so much. For example, when we couldn't afford food, क्योंकि I come from a middle class background myself, right? So there were times where we couldn't afford food, and the government supported us. These are the things that you look back as, as a countryman, and you go, like, कैसा beautiful place, man. Like, they really take care of their humans. अगर Pakistan में मुझे कुछ होता है Canadians, Canadian embassy would be the first one to raise the question. For example, if I get kidnapped or something. Right? They'd be like, where's our guy? And they'll come and they'll secure me and they'll save me and, know, do whatever is necessary to protect me. They really, really, really care for their humans. Therefore, you feel responsible कि यार you got to give back to the community. Like nationalism आपका ना भी होना, आप दिल में. उन्होंने एक belonging में रहा दिया ना क्योंकि because of its again Pakistan जो लोग

I feel like it's the same sort of दिल में जगह for Canada because of a lot of this communal you know connectivity जो उन्होंने रखी हुई है कि everybody grows together.

Nobody is ostracized to a side. Yeah yeah. They try to balance the society. They try to take a lot of money from the rich. Therefore, all the rich hate Canada. क्योंकि taxes जो है Canada के अंदर वह insane है like 50% or something is like the tax if you make over 6 figures. But the middle class is so large and everybody can afford good meals, good place to live at. So, yeah, I mean, like, there I I can literally pinpoint the reasons why people

love Canada and it makes complete sense. Yeah, as a 12 year old when you move to The US and Canada, I mean that's a very difficult age to move generally. Yeah. Because it can go either ways. So so what was that transition like for you? Yeah, I remember

my transition was extremely smooth in The US. At the time I didn't face a lot of racism honestly. अच्छा.

And what school were you in in Pakistan?

Beacon House. अच्छा. Yeah, beautiful school. कौन से हुआ है? Still miss it, defense campus.

दुनिया, मेरा ख़ैर नया नया बना होगा. BDC is very recent. पता नहीं मैं तो बचपन से ही चाह रहा अब

तो I mean I have been on this earth twenty eight years. I have known BDC for at least twenty seven.

वही मैं कह रहा ना कि because BDC is that a legacy school? इनका जो वो legacy वाले हैं वो तो वो हैं JT camp कौन सा है? Legacy school का क्या मतलब है? जो B B का ना जिस B का ना उसके ना जिस तरह यहां पर B का ना start हुआ था from a garage and then it moved to a proper big campus और वह फिर campus एक main campus है जिस तरह स्नाहाबाद में. अच्छा. There is BMI. BMI is the legacy campus. BMI में अब यह seen है कि BMI के graduates के बच्चे BMI में पढ़ रहे हैं. Oh. You know and then you have Beck जो कि comparatively recent है you have Potohall campus and so on and so forth. तो वह अब मतलब second generations आना शुरू हो गई है और वो broke करना शुरू हो गई है. But anyways, so BDC

जो ये main DHK के अंदर जो बिना Right? है Y block वाला. And so the transition in The US wasn't that bad. No. Actually I felt like I repeated a lot of stuff that I studied already last year. It was really smooth and and हां transition culture shock बहुत बड़ा था क्योंकि वहां पर आपको uniform नहीं पहनना पड़ता. आप जो आपका दिल करे वह कपड़े आप पहनाओ. एक और जो मेरे लिए बड़ी strange चीज़ थी वह यह थी कि teachers को आप teacher नहीं कहते आप उनको उनके Ma'am नहीं बोलते. Ma'am नहीं बोलते आप उनको उनके नाम से पुखारते हो. Miss sir Mister James, Miss Green यानी यह आप यह उनके अगर नाम है तो आप उनको नाम से पुखारते हो. एक और चीज़ यह थी कि वहां पर PDA बहुत देखने को मिला public show of affection, display of affection. I saw a first make out that I ever saw in real life was in the school and I was like यह क्या हो रहा है तबला कि और मिला रहा यह पता है यह first day in fact जब हम लोग जब हम लोग जैसे ही हम लोग funny thing my dad, my younger brother and me हम लोग गए high school के अंदर अपना registration कराने और वहां पर registration office के बाहर एक लड़का लड़की लगे हुए थे और मेरे dad ने देखकर कहा welcome. यानी कि welcome to America बच्चों. I mean that's that's part of their culture. So you just gotta be like you can't do anything and that's that's how they they're just open minded like that and I was to me that was mind bogglingly crazy. I'm like यार इनके parents को कोई बता देगा तो लेकिन to them it's just a norm. It is what it is. हां, I saw it in my so there was like a couple teacher and multiple times I saw them you know greeting each other with like cute small little kisses कि I am going to this, I going to that and I was like यार यह कैसे क्या यानी कि इनकी respect नहीं है यानी कि यह क्या करें? भैया I was awkward kid. I was an extremely extremely awkward kid. मैं मुझे इस चक culturally fit in होने में थोड़ा सा time लगा था because I was so shy that there was like a time when I remember this girl she really liked me and to me that was like तू पागल हो गई है यानी कि तेरा दिमाग ख़राब है और वह गोरी थी ठीक है. तो उसकी एक दोस्त है उसने मुझे आकर कहा कि you know she really likes you and she's gonna come talk to you tomorrow in the lunch. मैं school ही नहीं गया उस दिन. मुझे था कि मेरे से लड़कियां आकर बात करी मैं गिर जाऊंगा, मैं मर जाऊंगा क्योंकि मैं इतना shy लड़का था. कौन सी grade में यह हो रहा था? Yeah I think this was in grade eight middle school overnight. Oh wow. K nine होगा मुझे exactly याद नहीं है. But it's insane. Came to a point where you know the next day when I went to the school and I saw like these two girls walking उसकी दोस्त और वह खुद भी वह दूसरी side से walk कर रही है और मैं अपने दोस्त के साथ walk करके जा रहा था मेरा दोस्त का नाम जुरेज था उस वक्त. तो I was walking I wasn't having a conversation but I saw them coming from really far away. तो मैंने ना उसके साथ fake conversation के लिए शुरू कर दी जैसे मैं busy हूं. मैंने कहा हां तुझे पता है ना वह कहता तू क्या बात कर रहे हो? मैंने कहा तू चल and as we are crossing path with these two girls I know that होगा. उसको तो यह लग रहा होगा ना कि he hates me? हां उसको लग रहा होगा कि या तो यह या तो यह मुझसे नफरत करता है और he is not into girls. हां हां ये ऐसा है. Or he is a psychopath क्योंकि उनके culture के अंदर यह एक normal affection और showing your love for somebody is like completely normal. It's not like how you perceive it over here at all.

I feel like that's how they really that's the system right? That's the social structure through which they find couples

for themselves. Yeah. The other hand. यहां पर भी बहुत खूबसूरत है. यहां पर couples आंखों में बातें करते हैं. For example like अगर आपको कोई लड़की पसंद आ जाए school में मुझे याद है मेरे सारे दोस्त यानी कि बस बस समझ आ गई बस वह और उनके लिए वह ज़िंदगी उनकी वन गई है like उनको था कि यार I had the best day of my life. Because she blinked at me. You know what I mean she saw me. Eye contact develop हो गया डेढ़ minute के लिए. Think she's into me bro. But over there it's completely different. वहां पर वहां पर you need to you go out on dates, you have to be with somebody if you're with them, you're holding hands in the school. It's completely different. So that was a culture. Have you seen Korean dramas?

Thank god no. I would. I know. You would recommend me I drag on to one. Really? Just one. Which one? Crash landing on you आपने अपनी बेगों के साथ देखना है? Heavy. क्या है? ठीक है. It's a, it's a Korean drama बारह सोलह episodes का है. ठीक है? अच्छा मैं ऐसा analysis नहीं बता रहा. ठीक है? Ok. Korean dramas का scene ही होता है love stories होती हैं. ठीक है? बहुत चीज़ी होती हैं but बड़ी interesting होती हैं because उनका यह वाला scene होता है तो जो हमारा पाकिस्तानी प्यार है ना मैं ऐसा बताता हूं हमारा हम जब university में थे तो मेरा एक दोस्त आया उसने आकर मुझे बोला मेरी girlfriend है बहुत भी ज़िंदगी story सुनाई I don't know what she sounds like. She doesn't know what I sound like. Oh god. तो मैंने कहा तुम आठ साल से you know like हम but you are right कि आंखों आंखों में प्यार चल रहा है और दोनों तरफ से चल रहा है. So मेरे लिए यह बड़ी odd सी बात थी उसको देखकर and and जब हम पाकिस्तानी उसको देखते हैं तो ज़हर हम एक एक एक all every time that we in the media when we seen relationships more often than not आप जितने भी liberal हो जाओ as a पाकिस्तानी हम still वो awkward है अंदर से right? So हमारी relationships हमारी वो एक certain boundaries के अंदर ही operate करती है. हम you know बेगम के साथ बाहर जाए ना Dubai सुबह जाए तो वहां पर भी यूं हाथ रखेंगे तो दो second एकदम से होता है कि अच्छा नहीं हां मैं Dubai में ही हूं चलो ठीक है. यह situation मेरी है? Yeah वही है. But crash landing on YouTube मैंने देखा मैंने था it's great story it's a super cute show but उनका भी age ख़मार ही जैसा है. यार उन्होंने पांच episodes बनाई है literally जबकि वह जाकर उनके जब हाथ मिलता है ना तो उस हाथ को उतना जिस तरह उन्होंने direct किया है कि you really begin to really imagine the old times जब butterflies आती थी because आप touch होता था और आपको देखी.

वह जो feel आई है. अब

American high school dramas में क्या हो रहा है अच्छा यार बात की next scene bed. Yeah. You know it begins to feel very disconnected कि यार यह क्या है यह नहीं हो रहा है ऐसे like there is a lot more that goes on into a relationship there is a lot of these butterflies and connections and watch crash landing on you. I recommend it to anyone मेरा हमेशा 100 out of 100 score आया है everybody who hated Korean dramas और the ideas of them really love them. Sure. अच्छा Korean drama का मेरे दिमाग आया है. दूसरा सवाल मेरा यह था कि do you think यह बड़ा Pakistan में होता है कि यार यह बच्चे बाहर जाते हैं ख़राब हो जाते हैं And and यहां पर एक एक cross cultural exchange की बात आ रही है. How do you think all of this impacted you? Did just because oh my god you saw a couple of people making out in America which was a very normal cultural phenomena for a different set of people. Did that screw you up? Or in the longer run, how did that shape you and your understanding of different cultures? How did that shape your own identity as a Canadian, Canadian पाक्तानी मुस्लिम?

Yeah, I think I I learned this very early on and in my life के to judge somebody based on their culture or based on their opinion is not the greatest trait a human can have. In fact, is something that you should not have. You shouldn't judge anybody based on whatever their meaning for life is. हर किसी की अपनी definition होती है, अपना culture होता है. For example हम लोगों को लगता है कि जो गोरे हैं अगर वह show of affection करते हैं और PDA करते और वह उनका culture है और इस चीज़ में उनको खुशी मिलती है. हमारे लिए वह बेशर्मी है. हमारे culture के हिसाब से. Right. Therefore हम उसको label कर देते हैं बेशर्मी से. हां. Understandable. लेकिन अगर वही लोग आपको देखकर आपको अगर वह backwards कहते हैं तो फिर आपको वह चीज़ भी mind नहीं करनी चाहिए. अगर वह आपको कहते हैं कि आप oppress करते हैं औरतों को तो आपको फिर वह चीज़ भी mind नहीं करनी चाहिए क्योंकि आप करते हो या ना करते हो. हां again. उनके point of view से आप इस वक्त 18 hundreds में ज़िंदा हो. Right. क्योंकि दुनिया evolve हो रही है. मैं यह नहीं कह रहा कि वह सही है और हम गलत है. ना मैं यह कह रहा हूं हम सही बिल्कुल. है वह गलत मैं यह कह रहा हूं हर borders ना borders ने यह कर दिया कि societies बना दिए हैं और उन societies ने अपना अपना culture develop कर लिए evolution के through over time. अगर आप पांच, छह, सात हज़ार साल पहले चले जाओ तो यह जो आपकी communities होती थी जो कि tropical areas में अभी भी रहती हैं जो क्या कहते हैं उनको untouched humans जो होते हैं जहां पर जब आप उनको जाओ तो वह पत्ते पुत्ते पहन के घूम रहे होते हैं their ladies don't have anything up like उनका top तो उसी तरह empty होता है. हां. उनके अंदर बेशर्मी का concept ही नहीं है. हां. इसका यह मतलब नहीं है वह बेशर्म है. हां. That is how they live. That is their culture. Therefore they should not be judged for that. आपको पता ही नहीं उनका background क्या है? तो मैंने सबसे पहले यह realize किया कि just because they're different from me and just because their culture is completely different from me therefore they they're they don't deserve my judgment. I mean I shouldn't be able to judge them in a negative manner. So I pulled myself aside from that. Whether or not that affected my culture, I don't think so. I think if anything it just broaden my approach towards difference of opinion. And I feel like the more you travel around the world I actually recommend कि अगर आपके पास पैसे हैं या आपने कुछ चीज़ अपने लिए product खरीदना है या एक experience खरीदना है हमेशा experience खरीदो. बाहर जाओ दूसरे culture से interact करो. देखो जाकर कि लोग किस तरह रह रहे हैं, उनका खाना किस तरह का, उनकी language किस तरह के, वह किस तरह की बातें करते हैं, उनका relationships किस तरह के वह चलाते हैं. इससे आपका दिमाग open होता थोड़ा सा. You you you get to, you gather more information about humans that are not you, or not like you and therefore I think it's really good for your own evolution and your brain building and yeah, I mean, like, I I just realized the more I travel, the more I become open minded. And I I remain I I stick to my culture and my religion. It's close to my heart, but I don't judge anybody based on theirs as well. And I don't allow anybody to judge me based on my beliefs. वह एक framework है ना कि at the end of the day you have to define that framework. If you begin to say कि for example

I I I see that contradiction and framework a lot. पूरी दुनिया में आजकल तो polarization इतनी ज़्यादा है but for example हम कहते हैं कि Pakistan में हमें चीज़ें ban कर देनी चाहिए because वह हमारी culture से adhere नहीं करती. Mhmm. But हम कहते हैं कि France को पर्दा allow करना चाहिए. आप एक point पर आ जाएं या तो आप कहें कि यार मैं Pakistan को अपने स्थाल से रखूंगा. France जो भी करता है फिर वह उनका culture है. That's hypocrisy. हां, या आप कहते हो कि यार France को भी नहीं करना चाहिए. मुझे भी नहीं करना चाहिए. हम सबको रहने देना चाहिए. ना हमारे मुसलमान वहां पर पर्दा करके उनके society को तबाह कर रहे हैं. ना जिस चीज़ से आप disagree कर रहे हैं वह लोग जो भी कर रहे हैं वह करके आप destroy होंगे. हां, right? So. Exactly. So the framework has to be the same. It has to be rationalized कि आप जो भी argument लेकर आ रहे हैं. Conversation का मैं थोड़ा सा वापस ले पेटता हूँ. Canada right so what year is this when you landed there?

I think 2010 Right, शायद मुझे exactly याद नहीं है दो हज़ार दस ही था शायद दो हज़ार नौ या दस था. Tell me about some tell me about the experience growing up there.

I think वहां पर आपकी community like GZ and शामिद्री and all these are were they also in Toronto?

Yeah yeah we we lived thirty minutes away from one another at the time. अच्छा and did you guys know before know each other before the whole content situation? Nope. No idea. I I was they शाम और जैद तो creators थे पहले से. ठीक है. These are the Facebook days. ये जब बिल्कुल न्यायाया vine आया था ना तो उसके बाद एकदम Facebook revolution आई थी यानी कि जब Facebook पगल हो गया था. हर बंदे को Facebook account चाहिए था. तो उस वक्त I remember शाम and Zed were into Facebook and at the time I started getting serious about it और मेरे तीन हज़ार subscribers थे Facebook पर followers जो भी थे और उस वक्त मैंने एक video बनाई और वह मैंने देखा कि करूंगा. अच्छा 15 year old rage into like not 15. Don't know how old I was at the time. Maybe eighteen, nineteen. I don't remember. Surprisingly, Zede responded and he responded with love. He said, यार देख I'm sorry and I will make it up to you. Where do you live? And he asked for my address and he just showed up and he is like we will make a video together and we made a video I remember I made a video with Zed for the first time and that video ended up getting like 300,000 likes. Likes? उस वक्त views नहीं आते थे नज़र Facebook पर खाली likes आते थे. I am sure it had been more than 10,000,000 views or something. Overnight I felt like a phenomenon. Like overnight I felt like and at that point although I I was manifesting a lot of things I believe in manifestation I believe in have you read the secret? I haven't. The book? I haven't. You haven't? It's about it's about thinking of things happening and them happening. Yeah. I I don't know about that theory. I haven't read that particular book. Yeah. So, so I was manifesting this entire collaboration with Zed since I started making videos and it happened it had to happen and it happened this way. And I think that was my first real push. And then from that point on I I never looked back and then I think I met शाम right after that if I'm not wrong. उसको भी इसी तरह Facebook में मैंने message किया हुआ था and he probably noticed me as well and he replied and then ever since then शाम और ज़ैद मेरे दोनों बच्चे हैं क्योंकि वह इतने cute हैं वह हर वक़्त एक दूसरे से लड़ते रहते हैं और मेरा घर जो है वह बिल्कुल beach में आता है उन दोनों के घर के तो फिर मैं अक्सर उन दोनों को बुलाकर कहता हूं यार चलो यार अपनी अपनी गल्ला करो यार अपनी अपनी गल्ला करो it's ok. Are they are they are you guys all the same age? No no no I think ज़ैद and I are the same age roughly but श्याम is a little older than us. अच्छा. Yeah.

Why do you think there's so many people, so many breakouts from Toronto?

That's a very good question and surprisingly it all happened in the same town as well. I mean 30 kilometers radius के अंदर तीन Canadian youtubers उड़ गए. उस वक्त Pakistan की representation YouTube और Facebook content creation में पाकिस्तानी देसी content creation में from Pakistan side. खाली हम तीन ही थे at at a certain point and then a lot of people joined, a lot of people came after that but I I actually don't know the answer to that question and I wish I I knew.

बड़ा interesting है यह phenomenon कि दुनिया के किसी और center से इतना बंदा नहीं निकला. पाक्तानी communities बहुत जगहों पर है. London से नहीं निकला है इतना बंदानी Yog से नहीं निकला है. Perhaps it was also that we kept connected to each other. Connected to each other and then we built this competition

this healthy competition between one another कि यार उसने video बनानी है तो मैंने भी बनानी है and that just kept us moving forward and it came to a point where we got so big that nobody I guess tried to ever compete with us because they're like these guys are too big or something. I don't know. Like maybe I'm just talking nonsense at this point but that's the only way I can explain this कि why did nobody else come from anywhere else. I think धूमbros were really big at one point as well. धूमbros तो I think OGs हैं in a way that. Yeah yeah yeah. If anyone

else views now most a lot of people might not know them. मेरा generally यह होता है कि यार जो जितना पुराना है उसकी respect बनती है. वह तो OG's है. वह तो YouTube के time के ऊपर क्या कुछ नहीं कर रहे होते हैं. Doombros YouTube के दिलीप कुमार है basically. वह उन्होंने फिर ZAID ने sort of breakout करके अपना करने कोशिश की वो YouTube पे बड़े कर रहा था but वो YouTube को एक दिना it's a bit more slow and steady. Facebook really revolutionized the whole you know crazy viral situation and so मुझे याद है कि Zed and धूम bros were were similar आपको नज़र आता था और दोनों बड़े यो सब explorative से थे. Different different areas में चीज़ें try कर रहे थे on content and then Zed came on Facebook and the rest is history वाली बात है कि वो just you know went into another direction altogether. Yeah. When you started content, what, were you in high school? Were you in Yeah. At the time I was in high school.

कौन सा year? I think this was, grade 11 maybe, grade 11 or 12 when I, 12 maybe, when I really started getting serious about content creation. I remember it's like a motivational story. I I I've told this many times, but I think, like your audience can hear it too of the power of manifestation. मुझे और यह इसमें एक चीज़ भी झूठ नहीं है तो there I have no reason to lie about this but you know a lot of people can take away from this great things from this. मेरे ना 3,000 followers हो गए थे Facebook पर और मुझे चाहिए थे 100,000 followers. गोल था. एक second. No I'm I'm wrong. मुझे चाहिए थे 10,000 followers. 3,000 followers मैंने एक साल की मेहनत के बाद लगाया जाकर मैंने 3,000 followers कमाए थे. मुझे था कि यार एक साल हो गया और यह November 1 हो रही थी. November 26 को मेरी birthday होती है. मैंने कहा I I don't know how but I have to get to 10,000 followers by. My birthday. My birthday. I have to. Now this is I know these numbers are stupid please small at this point in this day and age लेकिन back then this was a Everything huge yeah yeah. क्योंकि 3,000 followers लगाने में मुझे एक साल लग गया था. मैंने कहा यार मुझे नहीं पता but I have the next twenty six days to to make it into a reality and I swear to God on the November 26 12:00 जैसे बारह बजे ना बारह बजकर पांच minute मुझे आज तक याद है. मैं दस हज़ार से followers hit किया था Facebook पर मेरी bird day पर.

I don't know how it happened

और जैसे यह magical story है ना कि it was insane to me at the time. That was my first exposure to manifestation. That was the first time I realized कि अगर मैं कुछ सोच सकता हूं तो मैं कर सकता हूं. उसके बाद there are there are like everything in my life. The collaboration with माहिरा खान, the collaboration with आतिफ असलम. I mean nobody else from YouTube has has got me the opportunity too until now I think. But and in fact collaboration with शाम and I still remember I know this is like gonna sound really funny but I used to take showers and showers I used to think of these ideas of different videos and different concepts in my head and at the time I had like ग्यारह बारह हज़ार मेरे followers होंगे Facebook पर और ज़ैद की उस वक़्त million plus Facebook पर थे और शाम के भी इतने ही कुछ थे और मैं सोचा करता था कि यार ये लोग मेरे से करीब ही रहते हैं somehow I'm gonna meet them and this is the idea I'm gonna pitch them and this is the video I'm gonna do with them और मैं नहाते वक़्त literally imagine कर रहा होता था कि हम यह shot ऐसे लेंगे, यह shot ऐसे लेंगे, यह shot ऐसे लेंगे और उसके ठीक दो तीन महीने बाद वह exact चीज़ हुई. मैंने जयद के साथ collaborate किया. However it happened it happened शाम के साथ collaborate किया. उसके बाद there is a video I made in 2017 आतिव असलम came to Canada for a concert and I went to his concert and I got the last seat and the 40,000 audience stadium and आतुफ़सलम कुमार दूर से देख hello किया आज आईसी बात तो नहीं देखा होगा. I was like shit yeah I was like I came back home that day I remember I was like I manifest today that in three years time I'll collaborate with आतुफ़सलम. I manifest that today and I made a video about this I made a vlog I uploaded that on YouTube it's still on YouTube I said कि आतुफ़ भाई आप आज आए यहां पर one day I'll meet you and that day is not far and three years time there's an opportunity that came my way. This brand reached out to me they said कि hey we want you to make a video. I realized that on that brand the panel of their artists had आतिवस्ना and I said hey listen if you don't give me any money but you give me आतिवस्ना for a video I think that would be like a fair deal. Listen no no we will give you money but we will try to get आतिफ too. Is that the one जो गाड़ी वाली जो थी? Yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah. And आतिफ आतिफ भाई उस वक्त दुबई में थे and I remembered वीलो reached back to me and वीलो said कि शाबीर आतिफ भाई has agreed to do your video and he is flying from the way to do your video And I was like, holy shit. It's like, you're inconveniencing him for this. Bro, too meve. Atev Assam is the biggest star of Pakistan, And he is our Shahrukh Khan. And I was like there is no way this is happening and I swear to god the moment आतिफ भाई pulled in with his वह छोटी सी Corolla में बैठकर आए थे because obviously he didn't wanna I I guess he was avoiding like big car ताकि लोग पीछे लगने हैं जो भी है पता होगा आता था so he was in Corolla driving himself and he looked at me and I was sitting in a fortuner just waiting camera ready सब कुछ मैंने पूरी script यार्थी है and आते भाई looked at me and he did this to me. I was like ok I don't remember what I'm doing here I I have no idea but I I look back to that and I go like यार everything in my life that I have manifested thus far has become a reality and the goals are larger and they just keep getting bigger and bigger and the power of manifestation is that that once you can imagine yourself doing something put yourself in a very put yourself imagine yourself doing something great if you can imagine it you can get there all you have to figure out is how to get there and it sounds easier said than done for every single person who's laying in their bed with a plate full of chips on their tid and they're eating it कि यार ये मैं तो मैं ऐसा नहीं होता होता है. यानी कि आपको उठना पड़ेगा आपको काम करना पड़ेगा होता है. बहुत लोगों को करते देखा है मैंने खुद किया हुआ है. सवाल है

you you you when did you make your first video? At what age?

Okay calm scratch that. Oh no I remember. I remember that. I think my first ever video was, was basically my my dad had left for Pakistan. We were in Canada, and it was his birthday. And it was me, my mom, and my brothers with me. And I was the eldest one. So I made, like, this one video for my dad not montage it was like a very interesting video is like POV from dad's my dad's point of view coming from work to home and how everybody wished him happy birthday. Oh interesting. And we it was like a fifteen minute video and I captured that कि वह office है और वह गाड़ी जला रहे हैं and the way he gets out फिर वह अपनी ऐनक लगाते हैं, रसाला पड़ते हैं तो वह सारी चीज़ें मैंने capture कि my dad saw this and my dad was like good direction and he showed it to everybody in my खानदान and everybody's like holy shit you're really good. And that was like my first dopamine hit. Yeah. That I entertain people. What? That can be done? And that was the first time I I kind of got an idea of what the value of video creation really is. What age was that?

Fourteen, fifteen? - ish. -ish. As a counter question, when did you get the idea of manifestation? Did you read a book? Did you were you introduced by someone,

about it? No. I think, it just happened accidentally because it made me feel good the fact that I'm seeing myself in positions that are attainable but not easily. And I feel like the the fact even to this day I go out on walks alone and I think about all the things that I wanna be and those things give me so much dopamine and they're so good for my brain and I just get really happy मैं खुद ही कह रहा हूं दो यार गोड़ियार गोड़ियार. Scene है तेरा भी Bro, तू best है bro. यार यह यहां तक पहुंच गया है. क्या शाहरुख खान के साथ collaboration?

नहीं but what I trying to get at is you know in Pakistan more often than not, I think before manifestation comes the ability to dream. Dream होती ना dream open होती है. I'm a dreamer. I don't know if it'll happen to me, I'll dream about it anyways. A lot of kids that I meet और मैं उनसे पूछता हूं कि अच्छा यार, you know, what do you wanna be? अगर तुम्हें सब कुछ मिल जाए, कोई मुफ़्त में मिल जाए, क्या मिल जाए? They're just blank. They're blur. It's like उनको उनकी direction उनका सब कुछ काट दिया गया और उनको एक डब्बे में बंद करके कहा कि बस अब तुम ना suffocating तरीक़े से इसी तरह जीते रहो. And which is one of the reasons why you find a lot of them coming on social media and being very aggressive as well. They're not aggressive at you. They're aggressive at the circumstances that they're in because they've been put into a box and they can't breathe. And so I feel like it's a it's an evolution and it's a very important evolution. अगर आपने if you want बड़ी बात करते ना हमारी youth बहुत बड़ा है. हमारा तकदीर बदल जाएगी youth बदले का तकदीर. यार misguided youth और unguided youth is still an irrelevant youth to be very honest and can be more damaging. अच्छा guide करने का मतलब क्या है? मैं नहीं आकर यह कहूंगा कि आप define करना शुरू करते हैं. Again एक डब्बे से नया डब्बार बनाकर उसमें डाल दें. I think अगर आपको renaissance चाहिए अपनी youth में तो आपको उनको सबसे पहले खाब दिखाना पड़ेगा कि यार खाब देखना सीखो. Choose to believe that interesting things can happen. Maybe even if you think it's not happening to you and then the next step is manifestation कि if interesting things can happen they can happen to me as well. You think growing up did you ever feel like कि बस ठीक है चलो चल रहा एक नज़ाम है and then eventually as things progressed and as you got began to get these experiences your dreams just sort of जो barriers थे वो बस कटते हैं कह रहे हैं यार ये तो ये भी हो सकता है अब वो but सारी खत्म हो गई है. Right so so so how would what are your thoughts on on this entire situation? Yeah M and M said it very nice as shoot for the moon you land amongst the stars.

I mean try to get up there You'll get somewhere is basically the message, behind that line. You said unguided youth is a destructive force, and I completely agree with it. I feel like uneducated youth is a liability, not an asset for anything. I mean, imagine yourself in a household जहां पर अनपढ़ बच्चे बड़े हो रहे हैं. Do you really think they're gonna change your fate for your household, for your family? They're never gonna be able to do that because they don't know how to think to begin with. Right? That being said, number one I forgot your question. Question was Number two. It was a necessary I have no idea what we're talking about. All I remember was you saying unguided youth is destruction. That's it. I was like, हां इस बारे में बात करनी है. I think you've already given me the answer. It wasn't a question per se. Was just your thoughts on you know कि हमारे youth को पहले हमें ख़ाब दिखाने पड़ेंगे और फिर हमें manifestation दिखानी पड़ेगी. हां अच्छा हां ख़ाबों के ऊपर ना मैंने एक चीज़ और भी share करनी है आपसे. मुझे याद आ गया आपने सवाल पुछा था कि did you read upon something that gave you that motivation and the answer is actually yes. I have always hated reading books. I'm not a reader at all. So I started listening to books because I realized one thing, and this is not very early on and I wish I I realized this early on in my years, is that, dude, reading or listening to books is the best thing you can do yourself do to yourself. You have no idea the potential. Imagine एक इंसान है और specially biographies. मैं मैं biographies के अलावा और कुछ नहीं पड़ता. मैं success stories पड़ता हूं because they give me the ability to dream what that person dreamt. I read Steve Jobs. I've read Elon Musk's biography. I've read Iran Khan's Pakistan personal history biography. And all of these books shaped the dreamer in me and, actually it really goes back to like the first instant if if I could remember it was the thought of dreaming got instilled in me after I watched three idiots the film. That film alone sold me on dreaming big. Really, really. That just struck struck a chord with me. It stayed in my head for a very long time. I realize there's a system and in order to break through the system, you cannot be a realist. I don't feel realists are any good for society. I don't think you should be a realist. I think everybody should be a dreamer, and I swear to god this world would be a different place. Everybody who has done something big in their lives were they were dreamers. They were not realists. They never looked at a situation and go like, oh, yeah, shit. This is not possible. Mhmm. Also, I hate the idea of plan b. I don't believe in plan b. I think you should only have plan a. Because if you have plan b, you always have a cushion to fall back on. I think that's that in itself is a weakness. I don't think nobody should be able to... If you're going for something, dude, get it don't come back without getting it I think that's the that's that's the attitude people should have लेकिन ये सारी conversations जब मैं अपनी cousin सुंदर के साथ करता हूं on sometimes on my podcast वो मुझे एक different perspective देती है क्योंकि उसका भी एक perspective genuine perspective एक opinion है वो कहती है नहीं देखो शाहीर तुम बात कर रहे हो from from privileged position. तुम बात कर रहे हो कि तुम Canada में थे तुम्हारे पास opportunity ज़्यादा थी opportunity cost कम थी. अगर तुम job ढूंढना चाह रहे हो तो तुम्हें actually कहीं job मिल जाएगी I understand all of that but the background that I come from dude I I remember working two full time jobs well one full time, one part time and going full time university. I remember those days and in that schedule I fit in making videos. I remember the time it would be snowing and I wouldn't have money to take the bus to go to school so I would wear boots and I would wrap myself with like Saran wrap around my jeans so बर्फ़ jeans के अंदर ना घुस जाए and walk to school which was fifteen minutes. I remember the time coming back from work at 1AM well 11AM को मेरी shift अगर 11PM को मेरी shift खत्म हो रही है या 11:30 खत्म हो रही है तो अगर 11:45 वाली bus miss हो गई तो अगली bus आएगी 12:45 and it's negative 30 outside and I have I don't have enough money to buy an expensive jacket so I have the jacket that I have and then I'm waiting one hour and freezing cold and by the time I get home my eyebrows are frozen and then I have to wake up five in the morning to go to school and then come back from school at three p. M. And go to my work and in the midst of all of that I have to make a video. Yeah. I have seen those days what I'm saying and I have seen those days where I became popular and I was working at that at the store it's called Popoys now and before that I was working at a pizza shop and then I also worked as Uber driver in all three instances I was popular enough where people would come and take pictures of me and one instance I was literally cleaning a toilet and some fans spotted me and he's like oh Shaveer and I was cleaning papa's car tow toilet and they come and they take a picture with me. And the other instance I was driving an Uber and every single time a Pakistan or an Indian would accept the car ride I'd be like oh shit they might know me and they would in most cases know me and they'd be like oh my god they're losing their shit and they go oh शादी शादी शादी शादी I'm like कि जाना के दिया आपको और वह तो पीछे भी नहीं बैठते वह तो आगे आकर बैठ जाते हैं सारे you know उनके अंदर नहीं है वह कि हम बड़े लोग हैं तो हम उबर में पीछे बैठेंगे नहीं वह आ गया के बैठते हैं. एक दिन मैं पोछा लगा रहा था pizza store के अंदर and fans recognize and they came in and they took pictures with me. So I have seen those days what I am what I am saying is just freaking be a dreamer. There's

nothing there there's no great joy than actually dreaming something and actually achieving it. I think in a lot of ways when I listen to the privileged conversation while very warranted in a lot of areas, A lot of people are beginning to discount real hard real hard work on the basis of privilege. Privilege की conversation बड़ी different context में आई थी और वही आई थी कि यार एक grow कर रहा है that is not privilege क्योंकि वह उसमें relative होगा साफ़ सी बात है. आप हर उस pictureरे जाएं. मैं आज content industry उठाता हूं कितने सारे लोग हैं, कितने सारे मशहूर लोग हैं up and down है सारा कुछ है. Public school के भी लोग हैं. I've spoken to on this on my podcast I have spoken to people जो कि literally गांव से निकलकर आए हैं. आपसे पहले मैंने अभी बात की अब्दुरादाग दाउत साहब से. Do you know about it? No, can you please tell me? He is the former minister of commerce. He is the founder of Descon. It's his family. So this is a गुजराती family. Is 80 years old now. He was born in the.

You did a podcast with somebody who is 80 years old? 80 years old. Amazing. Yeah and he he

came from the Indian state of गुजरात एक गांव से वह आए थे partition के बाद कुछ भी नहीं था उनके पास. वह बस partition के बाद यहां पर आ गए. यहां पर उनकी family ने Engrow बनाया. उनकी family ने वह business बनाया जो कि आज फात्मा fertilizer है. They were one of the biggest textile barons at one time. Descon which is Pakistan's largest engineering company but now is also one of the region's largest engineering company and has done a lot of work in the Middle East and has offices in 12 different countries. वो उन्होंने बनाई. अब लोग आकर बोले कि जी वो privilege थे. यार उस तरह के हज़ारों लोग आए थे. उन्होंने क्यों नहीं किया? हमारी industry में बहुत सारे लोग हैं. हर किस्म के background से हैं. आप पहना हुए हैं. उसमें बहुत सारे बच्चे ऐसे भी है जो कि they are just doing regular jobs. They are not, they are not earning as much, they are not connected as much, haven't in terms of and I am sure they are happy maybe. But the point is कि you don't nullify a person's achievements but not only that you don't nullify the idea of dreaming based on the privilege because dream की की height शायद फ़र्क़ हो सकती है relative के ऊपर but जो गांव का बंदा है शायद उसकी dream honest to god यो यार मैं शहर जाकर एक दिन बाबू बनूंगा and he can become that बाबू अगर वो dream तो करे ना यार.

Starts with a dream. Yeah. I mean yeah that the the point I guess, we are both making, for the past twenty minutes is that que you have a better chance of success if you learn to dream. Yeah. Rather than just being like, yeah, this is my situation and this is how it's gonna be. Yeah. You have a higher chance of achieving something only if you can envision it in the first place. Yeah. लेकिन you know all of that being said I also feel कि दुनिया कि दुनिया it's not fair. Sometimes you are just born in a situation where you can't do anything. For example, you are born in a gao and from let's say how do I say this without sounding ignorant? अच्छा you are born in a situation where your family responsibility and this is the point I was making earlier कि सुंदर brings these types of conversations to my attention the other side of the She was like you're born in a situation where you have a family of 10, your dad beats your mom on a daily, you at the age of 13 are pushed into, begging or anything or any work, for that matter because begging is now it's an industry, it's it's handled by different people. How do you how do you excel from that point on? I mean like obviously you cannot say कि a person who had an opportunity of going to a public school, a private school definitely has a better starting point. उसकी base बेहतर है या एक millionaire है जिसने अपने बेटे को US भेजा पड़ने के लिए चाहे उसको पैसा नहीं भी दिया लेकिन उसको education दिया, उसको experience दिया, उसको dream करने की ability दी तो

I think मैं इसमें difference पता कर ही करूंगा इसलिए मैं एक हमेशा कहता हूं your only competition is with yourself right and that's why I am constantly saying relative. A lot of times what we do is we tend to be like okay. If if a viewer is watching and he's like, wanna be a YouTuber and he begins to bake a goal, I want to be like Shahveer Jaffray and I am going to be Shahveer Jaffray. Yeah. I think that's a wrong goal. I think the context is different. I think if he he he says, ok, I want my voice to be heard. It's an entirely different dream altogether. Right? It has to be contextual as well. Like I mentioned आपने दोनों की मिसालें दी हैं. देखिए आपने इसमें मुझे जो core फ़र्क़ नज़र आया ना वह पैसे का आया. More often than not हम privilege है पैसा निकालते हैं. क्योंकि पैसे वाले का भाई बाप अपना alcoholic हो सकता है, मां को मार सकता है, ठीक है? वह तेरह मैंने मैं जानता हूं लोगों को. पैसे वाले लोग थे. बेटी, मां बेटी को घर से बाहर निकाल दिया. बच्ची बारह तेरह साठ के थे, कुछ समझ नहीं आई. Comfortable, seemingly comfortable family थी. You know high school तक बड़ा अच्छा वह क्या? पूरी दुनिया को देखा यह तो privileged है. अब बाहर निकाल दिया एक रुपया भी नहीं था शायद चलते हुए थोड़ा सा ज़ेबा ले लिया and then they really had to work hard to go through university and here public के face में वह यह तैयार यह तो you know private school graduates and then उसके बाद university भी अच्छी की. I think again वह जो आपने गांव वाली में साल दी तेरह साल की बच्ची वह करके begging कर रही है. That's just the worst example and I I I would empathize enough to to not be told to say that should also dream but generally अगर पैसे की बात आती है ना a lot of other things notwithstanding emotional चीज़ें जो हैं वह traumatizing होती हैं वह I understand. पैसे के बाद मामले में मुझे नहीं लगता वह मिली रहने अगर अपने बेटे को भेजा है भाई और उसने educate दिया तो उसका competition उसके साथ है और उसके तरह के लोगों के साथ है and how well he performs is dependent on his dreaming. वह अगर for example Elon Musk का बड़ा showroom समझता है. वह जी उसका तो बाप बड़ा privilege था. तो उसने जाकर कर लिया तो यार और कितने like his dad owned a few mines. There are thousand other people all over the world who own mines. You know how many of them actually made made a rocket ship or or or made self driving cars? Yeah. And do you compare Elon Musk to a kid from let's say लिया and and say कि यार वह Area Agriculture University से graduate करके you know why aren't you more like Elon Musk you stupid shit. Yeah. नहीं I guess guess I guess the right way to put this is कि there are

examples from both sides of the spectrum where extremely privileged मां बाप जो हैं वह बहुत ही बिगड़े हुए और unsuccessful बच्चे पैदा करते हैं और in some cases बहुत ज़्यादा unprivileged लोग कुछ ऐसे geniuses पैदा करते हैं जो कि जाकर दुनिया change कर देते मैं वो नहीं कह रहा. But the extremes on both ends is what matters. When you take out the ratio ना obviously a person with a better education has a higher rate of success than person. हां अगर उस में flat होते हैं. अगर आप ratio देखो Absolutely. And majorities जो होती है ना वह change करती है. दुनिया for example Elon Musk is on a mission to make as many babies as possible because literally in his book he mentioned that that there too many dumb people having babies and that is not good for the evolution of humanity because we are gonna be dumber as a nation. So I'm I know I'm a genius. He goes he he said that obviously he's a genius if he's not an alien. That I think I am a genius and I need to have as many babies as I possibly can because that is gonna, that is gonna be good for this upcoming society. हो सकता है एक उनमें से कोई Einstein दुबारा निकल आए. You know what I mean? तो I guess that is also important. That is also very important to have. मतलब privileges? Real, yeah. Absolutely. I mean like can you discount the fact that you are, you and I are not extremely privileged right now? You know how I see this situation? There are only 700,000 famous people in the world. Yo for you guys to listen to this very important. There are only 700,000 famous people in the world. Really? That's how I reacted when I found out. In the age of TikToks and हो सकता है बढ़ गए हों. तो चलो दस million हो गए. दस million है दस लाख? दस million हो गए. ठीक है? एक करोड़ बनता famous है. कितने लोग हैं दुनिया में? आठ अरब. What's where do you land? On top of that, if you have a roof over your head, they say you are better than 50% of the world or 75% of the world in some cases. Yeah. Right? If you have clean water to drink, you're better than 80% of the world. Yeah. Where exactly would you place yourself in this luckiness, lucky spectrum? You're sometimes you're just born lucky. You're born a human that's dude that's lucky AF. You could've been born as an ant. Think about it for a second. मैं पागल हूं तो इन चीज़ों को सोचकर. You know there are more ants. If you were to take all the humans and you weighed them and you took all the ants and you weighed them, the ants would weigh higher. Really? जी that's how many ants there are. इतनी चूंटियां है दुनिया में. Is weird. Is weird. Weird trick you have to know. I am just saying that there are trillions trillions of species living things and yet you are a human being with the ability to think intellectually, intelligently. You are amongst the fame kinds, you're amongst the ones who have clean water to drink, you're amongst the ones who have a roof over their head. How if this is not a dream or a simulation I don't know what is. हां, but देखिए इसमें हमें एक chance if coin flip हो ना और हमारी position में अगर आना हो one and a trillion chance, one and trillions हो. एक trillion दफा tail आएगा और एक दफा heads आएगा पता वह chance आ है मैं privilege को किस तरह से देखता हूं. मैं हमेशा इस तरह से देखता हूं. I don't use privilege as a way

to to make excuses for myself. I use privilege as a way to to practice gratitude. ठीक है? Probably जो जो मैं कहना चाह रहा हूं ना मैं यह कहना चाह रहा हूं कि more often than not I see people who always look at those above themselves and they say I can't do what I can't do because of them because वह तो मेरे से बेहतर है. So case closed book बंद मैं बैठ गया. एक बंदा कोई एक बंदा ऐसा नहीं है जो कि Pakistan में top 5% में नहीं आता. मेरा एक भी बंदा मैं आज guarantee लगाकर देता हूं कि और आपका भी जो viewer है वह top 5% का मतलब हो पता है कि है ten fifteen million people बंदा है. Yeah. But do we think that? We don't because we are not looking at the bottom quartile. We are always looking at कि वो चाचू Dubai में उनके पास गाड़ी कितनी अच्छी है. वो मेरे school में सबसे अमीर तरीके बच्चा है उसका क्या scene है? Yeah. And so we are constantly feeling bad about ourselves and we are being fed to feel bad about ourselves. Yeah you want these guilt trips. हां. For just being successful. हां. नहीं नहीं मैं यह नहीं कह रहा sorry. नहीं as a मैं कह रहा कि हां we are being guilt tripped. Not being able to think As creator I am being guilt tripped. मैं मैं as an individual कह रहा हूं कि we are forced to be make our like हमें बस बुरा feel करा के कि यार तुम तो बेचारे बहुत लोग अमीर हैं and you are forced to not even try. Yeah. To be better because जब आपको अपनी privilege का अपनी privilege का हर इंसान को एहसास होता है ना तब जाकर वह कहता यार मेरे आपने जब बोला ना कि पूरी कायनात में खर्मों species and खर्पों living उसमें the chances of you being a human being with an intellectual mind and an ashuffle मुखलूकात यार उस उस बात को ही सोचकर मैं सोचता हूं कि आपके I don't care आपके क्या circumstances हैं आपको फिर भी हाथ पव मारनी चाहिए. Absolutely. Because आप जानवरों से बेहतर है आप चूंटियों से बेहतर है. Yeah. You know so so as long as the. Do you believe that? Do you believe we are better than animals?

Do you believe humans are better than dogs? Heart wise?

I I do. Yes. Really? I think inherently we are. I think dogs don't kill each other, man. If you put if you take a dog and if you beat it black and blue Yeah. And you starve it Yeah. You're going to have a very rabbit dog. Yeah. If you take care of a dog with love Yeah. You will find the most loving specie on the planet. I would like to do the same to humans. I think it's Have you ever met have you ever pet stray dogs? I have and they become really जब वह मैं वही कह रहा ना उनको प्यार बिलते हैं वह U flip करते हैं. मैं यह कह रहा as a species it's the hardware right? So as a hardware you have the most advanced hardware. आप उसके ऊपर घटिया software install कर दोगे ना तो even the best processor is going to be useless. Yeah. The fact is कि आपके मतलब आपने यह बात की कि आप अपने लोगों को देखते हैं और मैं अपना Pakistan में देखता and just some of the things that I hear some of the inhumane things that I hear and then I hear people defending them and it just breaks my heart and it and I realize मैं I try कभी आप कपड़ा दिल करते हैं क्या जाहिल लोग हैं और फिर कभी को बार मैं सोचता हूं कि यार इनकी तो ग़लत ही नहीं है. Product of the society है ना at the end of the day. Software तो इनके ऊपर install किया गया है consistently. So I to answer your question I do believe human beings are they're just it's it's unfortunate. It's unfortunate as a society the cards that we've been dealt with.

I guess, man. I guess. I I just don't I don't believe that. I think dogs are much better. Not that I want to be a dog because dog is also looked down upon in our society, तुम्हें उस अंदाज़े से नहीं कह रहा. मैं किसी को यह नहीं कह रहा कि तुमसे बेहतर तो कुत्ता ही है. But if you if you were to keep a dog which breed would you keep? I have a dog. Which one? Golden retriever.

Yeah I wanna get I'm not a dog person. Really? Not at all. Really? Okay. But my my I wanted to get one for my son because every dog person that I've seen who's grown up with a dog has a beautiful personality.

That's a very very very good.

क्या कहते हैं उसको analysis? Realization about it? True. I agree with it. There is a certain level of emotional intelligence that comes with sort of having a companion like that. I I was so so it's interesting that you mentioned because मेरे दिमाग में मैंने बड़ा z search किया था अपने हिसाब से obviously like dog owners are are are very उनका एक different experience होता है but मैं पहुंचा था golden retriever पर for a three year old when he gets three. Do you think that's a good choice? Beautiful choice.

I I don't think there are better dogs than golden retriever period. I think they're the best children dog ever. They're the best dogs ever. I mean, the love the love a golden retriever or lab has is just insane. Just pull out like golden retriever with babies I am now. And you'll I bet you'll cry at the end of the Yeah. It's so caring. And it's phenomenal because you don't really imagine them to be emotional on that level. They're they're fairly emotional. Yeah and they're the way they the way they change their physical movement with the baby versus with you is different. They realize that this is a fragile thing. This is not equals to that. This is fragile. This is a baby. I gotta be more precious with this little one. And I think to me that is just you're about right about the emotional intelligence part, that dogs have some

crazy emotional intelligence. And how difficult is it to keep one? I mean, I know that you're moving around all the time, you're fairly busy.

Do you have one in Pakistan or in Yeah. No. I have one in Pakistan, and my brother has one in Canada as well. So how does that work? Like a dog family. हमारा, yet, I have whenever I'm moving, I make sure there's somebody here who takes care of the guy but in most cases I am just here I mean. Exercise वगैरह चाहिए होती है हां वह वो तो थोड़ा सा उफ उफ मेरा वाला तो है ही mental ना वह तो उसको मैं कहते ही mental उसको मैं कहता हूं मैं mental इधर वह तो पागल है वह तो if he saw you ना he literally come and just sit on your lap and he's a big guy he thinks he's this big but he's not he's huge and he doesn't want to believe that he's grown up now he's a year and a half now he doesn't want to believe that He believes he's still a little baby, and he wants attention all the time. And Is he an indoor dog or an outdoor dog? Outdoor dog. My wife would kill me. Otherwise, that dog would be if I didn't have a wife, I would have a dog inside the house.

Makes sense, me. Yeah. Shahbir, I'm gonna wrap this up. At an hour sixty minute mark. But I'm gonna ask you one question. Generally, I ask all of my guests, and I want your insight on that. You spent a fairly large part of your life early on in Pakistan then you guys moved to Canada, US and then Canada. वहां पर ज़ाहिर आपके different experiences थे. Eventually reverting and choosing to be back to back in Pakistan. जाहिर है कि आपका एक बड़ा difference का scope होता है. एक तो बाहर time गुजारना but एक formidable years में time गुजारने से ना आपको एक बड़ा different foundation बनती है. जिसके बाद जब आप Pakistan आते हैं तो आपको एक बड़ा different experience मिलता है. Knowing that experience, knowing all of what you've been able to understand in the past what three, four years since you're here? Three years. Three years and now you know living here with your wife you're essentially settled in a way. How do you see Pakistan twenty eight years from now? In 2050? Damn. Yeah, you know अगर think about it, take your time but होता है ना एक बंदा देखता है changes देख रहा होता है कि यार मुझे macro level के ऊपर लोग किस तरह change होते नज़र आ रहे हैं? Politics किस तरह change होते नज़र आ रही है? Don't know अगर आती है, economics किस तरह change होते नज़र रही है but दुनिया किस तरह changes आ रही हैं उसमें Pakistan क्या किरदार रख सकता है? You just came back from Google Singapore. You know वहां पर the idea that oh they are taking Pakistan seriously suddenly. Yeah. Can they do that? और यह भी हो रहा है. So all of this put together the positives and the negatives. What's your image of Pakistan?

Dude that's the problem with being a dreamer. You always hope for the best. You always envision the best. You I I think look the thing is saying that you know we are a beautiful country and we have the best people and we have the best government and best economy obviously everybody knows everybody will see through the bullshit and they'd be like say सच बोल. Camera पर डरते हो तुम लोग सच बोलने से क्योंकि hate मिलेगी. That being said I know the problems I know the issues I don't discuss politics in general I think it's you'll never get the message across because there's always two sides to a story and everybody wants to hear their side. I feel like अगर हमारे मुल्क में और मुल्क से मेरा मतलब है अगर हमारे लोगों में acceptance आ जाए ना, acceptance of ideas कि अगर यार यह बंदा है ना यह बंदा ऐसा है लेकिन है तो इंसान अच्छा है. खूबसूरत इंसान है. इसको मैं इंसान की तरह respect दूंगा. चाहे इसकी opinion से मैं agree नहीं करता. चाहे मेरे बाप ने कहा है कि यह इंसान की opinion गंदी है. लेकिन as a इंसान मैं उसको इंसानी दर्जा देते हुए उसकी respect करना चाहता हूं. अगर हमारे अंदर यह चीज़ आ जाए ना I think we will turn around so fast and in twenty eight years there there will be another Muzahmala and Shahvir podcasting and talking about how there's a new 150 floor high rise that is being built in Lahore. Yeah. I hope that day would come and I really freaking hope that, you know, all the pun pundits and the analysts are wrong about their default situation of Pakistan and I really hope we turn around, man. But I I think it begins with the people. They are not the best right now and they gotta be I think a lot more introspection is needed in all of us. For sure, man. 100%. Thank you so much for coming in, taking the time out. I know that, you you had a early morning flight, and so, but, you know, thank you. Thank you so much for having me. And, by the way, now that we're signing off the first thing we spoke about was the shorts, right? Yeah. So I just wanna say the name of the guys सलमान हुमान with the 10,000,000 subscribers there. I shall check him out. Shall check him out. But

yeah, thank you. Thank you for coming in. Thank you so much, man. But anyways, this was Sayyid Muzambelas and Zeri. You were watching thought behind things. Thank you so much for watching, and I'll see you in the next one.